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Home My WebLink AboutFW: 160 Main Ave S Permit #20-1347 - conduit podium penetration continuity Mike Plane From:Jon Victor Sent:Friday, July 8, 2022 16:49 To:Matthew Long Subject:FW: 160 Main Ave S Permit #20-1347 - conduit podium penetration continuity Can we talk about this Monday? Respectfully, Jon Victor Building & Mechanical Plans Examiner 208-735-7291 jvictor@tfid.org nd City Hall (2 floor) 203 Main Ave. E. Twin Falls, ID 83301 From: Brian Wenzel <brian@PivotNorthDesign.com> Sent: Friday, July 8, 2022 1:30 PM To: Jon Victor <JVictor@tfid.org> Cc: Brandon Swanson <Brandon.Swanson@PivotNorthDesign.com>; Corey Barnes <Corey@PivotNorthDesign.com>; Trey Dice <TDice@csdiconstruction.com>; Jack Lunsford <jlunsford@csdiconstruction.com>; John King <John@PivotNorthDesign.com> Subject: 160 Main Ave S Permit #20-1347 - conduit podium penetration continuity \[EXTERNAL SENDER\] Hi Jon, good morning. We received an RFI on a slab penetration for out 160 Main building; the issue as we understand is trying to understand how to rate holes in the 3-hr podium that penetrated by electrical feeder chases, as the holes are bigger than the annular spaces around the conduits.. 1 Rather than figure how to fireproof the opening around the conduits, we were looking to create continuity by means of a vertical shaft enclosure; I understand from the 2015 IBC we can have a 2hr shafter penetrating the 3hr podium, because it connects 4 or more floors (IBC 713.4): 2 We have received a reading that the shaft can jog horizontally so long as the horizontal portions are horizontal assemblies and the vertical portions are wall assemblies. We received input from our code consultant that this would suffice to protect those openings with conduits in continuity. Below please find my understanding of a detail from US Gypsum and links showing 2hr horizontal shaft detail: 3 https://www.usg.com/content/usgcom/en/design-studio/shaft-wall-limiting- heights.html?facets={%22k%22:%22Fire_Rating_UOM_en_s%22,%22v%22:\[%2202::2%20hr.%22\]}&tab=horizontal- shaft-wall https://www.usg.com/content/dam/USG_Marketing_Communications/united_states/product_promotional_materials/f inished_assets/usg-shaft-wall-systems-catalog-en-SA926.pdf The detail is clearer in the second link, page 23 of the document (I’ve also attached): We would look to do a three sided detail like so: 4 Would this detail suffice to jog the shaft and use its continuity instead? For clarity, here below is a picture of the shafts in question as they penetrate the level 3 podium from the upper (type V) floors: 5 Here is how we propose the shafts from above track through level 2 2-hr podium; the blue are horizontal 2-hr ducts, the red are the shafts as they go down from level 2 into level 1: 6 Here is how the shaft lands on level 1, transitioning from above to the electrical room: 7 We are looking to upgrade the rating of the electrical room to 2 hr per 713.11, or if easier, explore adding dampers per 713.11 method 2 exception 1: 8 Again, happy to chat if easier and you are able, thank you!! Please let me know if you have any questions or comments, thank you. Brian Wenzel, RA SENIOR DESIGNER Temporary Address: 300 W Main St., Suite 200, Boise, ID 83702 c: 510.364.4289 From: Brian Wenzel Sent: Tuesday, July 5, 2022 1:05 PM To: Tom Jaleski <tom.jaleski@codeul.com> Cc: Brandon Swanson <Brandon.Swanson@PivotNorthDesign.com>; Chad Gierhart <chad@pivotnorthdesign.com>; John King <John@pivotnorthdesign.com>; Corey Barnes <corey@pivotnorthdesign.com> Subject: RE: Podium penetration of conduits/ ducts Thanks much, for the prompt reply as always Tom! Please let me know if you have any questions or comments, thank you. Brian Wenzel, RA SENIOR DESIGNER Temporary Address: 300 W Main St., Suite 200, Boise, ID 83702 c: 510.364.4289 From: Tom Jaleski <tom.jaleski@codeul.com> Sent: Tuesday, July 5, 2022 12:34 PM 9 To: Brian Wenzel <brian@PivotNorthDesign.com> Cc: Brandon Swanson <Brandon.Swanson@PivotNorthDesign.com>; Chad Gierhart <chad@pivotnorthdesign.com>; John King <John@PivotNorthDesign.com>; Corey Barnes <Corey@PivotNorthDesign.com> Subject: RE: Podium penetration of conduits/ ducts Brian If the 2 hour rating goes to the ground floor, you can jog it to include the full run of the conduit and no slab protection is required. Understand that the shaft wall assembly at the jog, where it goes horizontal, cannot be a wall assembly, it needs to be a horizontal assembly. Thank you Tom Jaleski Principal 503.860.7501 | Connect A Minority-Owned Business This message may contain confidential communications and/or privileged information. If you have received it in error, please delete it and notify the sender. Any disclosures, copying, distribution or use of the information received in error or contained herein is strictly prohibited. From: Brian Wenzel <brian@PivotNorthDesign.com> Sent: Friday, July 1, 2022 4:08 PM To: Tom Jaleski <tom.jaleski@codeul.com> Cc: Brandon Swanson <Brandon.Swanson@PivotNorthDesign.com>; Chad Gierhart <chad@pivotnorthdesign.com>; John King <John@PivotNorthDesign.com>; Corey Barnes <Corey@PivotNorthDesign.com> Subject: RE: Podium penetration of conduits/ ducts Hi Tom, good afternoon. I called Hilti per our discussion; contractor had some concerns about the built up system we discussed. Could we jog the shaft and use its continuity instead, and if so, does the horizontal part of the jogging shaft need to be 3-hr or 2-hr, sketch below. 10 Here is a picture of the level 3 shafts in the upper floors: Here is how they track through level 2: 11 Here is how the shaft lands on level 1: 12 Again, happy to chat if you are able, thank you!! Please let me know if you have any questions or comments, thank you. Brian Wenzel, RA SENIOR DESIGNER Temporary Address: 300 W Main St., Suite 200, Boise, ID 83702 c: 510.364.4289 From: Tom Jaleski <tom.jaleski@codeul.com> Sent: Friday, July 1, 2022 2:49 PM To: Brian Wenzel <brian@PivotNorthDesign.com> Cc: Brandon Swanson <Brandon.Swanson@PivotNorthDesign.com>; Chad Gierhart <chad@pivotnorthdesign.com>; John King <John@PivotNorthDesign.com> Subject: RE: Podium penetration of conduits/ ducts Brian Did you get my response yesterday? I had a couple of questions. For the most part you can use any one of numerous listed assemblies, from mineral wool with fire caulk, to sleeves. The picture looks like they may have used a shaft liner from the floor below up through the upper floors, which also works. I will re-send my e-mail from yesterday. Tom Jaleski Principal 503.860.7501 | Connect A Minority-Owned Business This message may contain confidential communications and/or privileged information. If you have received it in error, please delete it and notify the sender. Any disclosures, copying, distribution or use of the information received in error or contained herein is strictly prohibited. From: Brian Wenzel <brian@PivotNorthDesign.com> Sent: Friday, July 1, 2022 11:30 AM To: Tom Jaleski <tom.jaleski@codeul.com> Cc: Brandon Swanson <Brandon.Swanson@PivotNorthDesign.com>; Chad Gierhart <chad@pivotnorthdesign.com>; John King <John@PivotNorthDesign.com> Subject: RE: Podium penetration of conduits/ ducts Hi Tom, good afternoon. Did you have a chance to review this? Please let me know if you have any questions or comments, thank you. Brian Wenzel, RA SENIOR DESIGNER Temporary Address: 300 W Main St., Suite 200, Boise, ID 83702 c: 510.364.4289 13 From: Brian Wenzel Sent: Tuesday, June 28, 2022 11:19 AM To: Tom Jaleski <tom.jaleski@codeul.com> Cc: Brandon Swanson <Brandon.Swanson@PivotNorthDesign.com>; Chad Gierhart <chad@pivotnorthdesign.com>; John King <John@pivotnorthdesign.com> Subject: Podium penetration of conduits/ ducts Hi Tom, good morning. Hope you are well. We received an RFI on the 4-over-2 podium in Twin Falls, ID. We received an RFI for the podium penetrations, which I’ve attached, including photos of the penetration conditions. It appears we have two types of penetrations the code officials are looking for direction on how to fireproof, conduits, and ducts. th We received this picture from another completed podium at 6/Front in Boise, addressing the large shaft condition. You can see the infill of the hole with the duct for retail. I understand the contractor for that project worked with AHJ to approve a shaft liner-like condition installed horizontally; I understand we need 3-hr for level 3 podium (separating level 3 R-2 and level 2 B occupancies) and 2-hr for level 2 podium (separating level 1 retail and level 2 business) to reduce the penetration gaps. The contractor in that podium project had worked with the contractor and building official to work out these items. For the conduit condition, I understand the allowable Horizontal Assembly penetration allows a calculation of 144 sf per 100 sf, and the building official may be able to help us determine how that is calculated. Our contractor in Twin Falls discussed this with them, and the AHJ is looking for direction from us on how to address code protection of these openings. Have you seen this condition, or do you have any advice on how to provide them documentation to satisfy? Is there a point in the code I can direct them to other than 714.4.1 incl. code commentary below? Thanks!! 14 Please let me know if you have any questions or comments, thank you. Brian Wenzel, RA SENIOR DESIGNER Exciting things to come in 2022! While we eagerly await our new space in Downtown Boise, we have moved into a temporary office to stay connected with our team and clients! Temporary Address: 300 W Main St., Suite 200, Boise, ID 83702 208.690.3108 x718 c: 510.364.4289 pivotnorthdesign.com 15 16